Kisses from Kenya Episode 2: Comfort Vs. Safety

Premiered on 6 Dec 2025  Kisses From Kenya

What happens when two Americans living in Kenya realise that comfort and safety are not the same thing, and that identity does not travel neatly across borders? In this episode of Kisses from Kenya, we explore fear, freedom, and the contradictions of life abroad.

In Episode 2, Brendan and Vuyanzi dive into what it means to navigate overlapping identities in a new country. Brendan unpacks the quiet calculations queer people make about safety, visibility, and vulnerability in the United States, and how living in Kenya reframes those instincts. Vuyanzi explores the idea of the “walking contradiction”, the moments where being a Black American in Kenya disrupts and reshapes her sense of self.

Together they talk about how both the United States and Kenya hold different kinds of danger and comfort, how cultural expectations collide, and how living abroad forces you to renegotiate who you are in public and in private.

This episode explores safety, race, queerness, belonging, and the uneasy dance between fear and freedom.

Chapters

• Introduction
• Whose America Is It Anyway?
• Comfort and safety abroad
• Walking contradictions in daily life
• What we are learning about ourselves
• Closing thoughts

Transcript

Vuyanzi 0:06

Hey, Kisses from Kenya is produced by Democrats Abroad Kenya, but everything you hear in this podcast reflects our personal perspectives.

Brendan 0:20

Yes. And this is an entertainment space and not an official policy platform.

Vuyanzi 0:33

Thank you.

Brendan 0:35

Yes. And we're here on our still as of yet under the podcast. So let's get into it. This week we're opening with um our queer and black joy corner. So we'd love to hear a moment of Black Joy.

Vuyanzi 0:54

So that was in the tune of good times. All right. But I'll do a whole theme. So my black joy this week. Good black joy. I guess I get a little Holy Spirit with it too. So this week, actually, uh, this is palpable because when we said we were going to do this, I knew immediately what I would talk about. So this week I did a facilitation because I do training and facilitation for an NGO here in Kenya.

Brendan 1:26

Play yourself, baby.

Vuyanzi 1:29

You never know who's watching. You never know. Hi. Facilitator here. But anyway, they were such a smart group. It was about 15 of them. And I won't say who they are, but they were such a like the minds that were there. The thoughts they came up with, the ideas. And even when they were looking at content being presented by their other colleagues, the way they dissect and think about it. I was like, wow, what a smart group. And then I looked around the room. Yes, I know I'm in Kenya. However, you got to remember, right? Coming from where I came from, to look around the room and everyone in that room, well, except for the global person who would come in, but they were all black people. And it's something about being in places and spaces with black people after I guess maybe it's trauma that I had in the States, right? Because blacks being looked at in a certain way, looked looked down upon, the the uh lack of intellectual ability. Uh we know that's not true, but the things in which we saw the buffoonery, the foolishness on TV, the stereotypes. But to be in a room where people were so smart and they, you know, in a in essence, looked like me, that gave me some black joy. And uh for you. What did you have? What did you experience this week? What's some queer joy you experienced this week?

Brendan 3:01

Um, you know, my one's funny because uh I I had a first, which, you know, at my elderly age, like one does not have many of those when it comes to at least, you know, queer life. We'll leave that also for another. My first time. Um it's been a while since I said it. Uh by the way, I I didn't give my usual disclaimer that this is not an official statement on behalf of Democrats of Brock.

Vuyanzi 3:30

I think we'll just have to do a recording that always goes at echoes at the beginning. Yeah. In the beginning.

Brendan 3:35

Please. But um, sorry, I got distracted. Uh so there was a speed dating event called Nectar and Night that a couple of my friends put on.

Vuyanzi 3:49

Wow.

Brendan 3:49

Um, and I was like, so I was like very nervous about going to it because I've never done speed dating. Yeah, yeah. And I've never done that. Also, like all of my friends that were promoting this are like in their 20s and like muscle bound. So I was just like literally like for weeks, I was like, am I gonna be the crypt keeper of Next Dead? Like hello. I'm here. No, I wasn't gonna be, but I think one thing that was like wonderful about it was like, you know, like I didn't have any anxiety about the queerness of it, or like being, you know, visibly gay, going to a thing. Yeah, like that was all very affirming. It was just like, am I gonna be the elder? Right, right. On the verge of the other, are you gonna be the old gay? The old gay.

Vuyanzi 4:42

Oh, there he goes.

Brendan 4:44

Floating around.

Vuyanzi 4:45

You know that old gay that used to appear every day.

Brendan 4:47

When I just like appear with like Maya Angelo next to me.

Vuyanzi 4:52

I wish we could do her voice in it, that would just wrap a bow on something.

Brendan 4:56

I'm quite sure I'd be canceled if I did that. I think it's this is true. But um, no, like, I mean, it was like such a beautiful experience. I mean, definitely like most of the men that I met were like in their 20s. But you know, they were still like, hey, can I take your number? So I had that moment of like she still got it. But it was also just like, I mean, that experience, like similar, right? Like of like being in a space, and like they set it up really beautifully. Like, there was a space for gay men or you know, like men who MSMs, you know, men who love men. There was a space for women, you know, who also are attracted to their women. They had their own little speedy data. There was also a space for the heteroes, like with their own speedy games. What? And so but it was mostly, you know, the gays because again, like the marketing was very clearly like here's like a bunch of nipples and peck. But similarly, like being able to like kind of like pause in the middle and like look around, and it's like here's like 60 like gay men in Nairobi, Kenya. What? Doing like the speed dating. That's amazing, like going around meeting. Like, it was just beautiful. Um, and like all of my anxiety, I think, definitely boiled down to like prom also trauma. I mean, doesn't it usually?

Vuyanzi 6:23

Yeah.

Brendan 6:23

Um, but all I could think of was like, you know, it's like that like moment at the prom, you know, where it's like, is anyone gonna ask me to dance?

Vuyanzi 6:30

Yeah.

Brendan 6:31

You know, because it's like you have to rotate, and I was one of the ones who was staying like in one seat. So it's like, is anyone gonna come and sit in my channel?

Vuyanzi 6:38

Oh gosh, oh my gosh, oh my gosh. By the way, I didn't go to prom. I I was pregnant at the time. That's an that's a story for another day. We have a lot of stories for the time.

Brendan 6:51

But but you did get asked to dance. Yeah, like many times. And as Blanche would say, many, many, many, many times. Um yeah, it was just, I mean, it was beautiful. Um, and and despite all that anxiety, like, I mean, it was so positive. I mean, and you had all different body types, you had all different ages, you had all different, you know, shades of skin, you had all different heights, like, like it was just like such a mixed group of people. But even like if you sat down across from someone and it was like, I don't think like you know, this is gonna happen. I'm not trying to smash, but like I was gonna say something else that would have been really rude.

Vuyanzi 7:33

So let me just be quiet. Look at you, look at me. This is not gonna ever they don't fit together the right.

Brendan 7:40

Like, even in those instances, yeah, yeah, yeah. People were still like, oh, you know, like I feel like like I like your vibe, like I like your style, like we should be friends. Let me follow you on Instagram. Like there was no, like, at least in my experiences, of course, I can't speak for everyone else. Like, I had no experiences that either I or I I hoped like the other person that was with me like felt less than, you know, because of like that desire piece that we like put so much weight on.

Vuyanzi 8:10

So it was beautiful. Oh, that's great. I feel the joy from that story. I mean, I'll bring you on to the next roof if you want to go in there. I know. How big was the heterosection? I mean, it was smaller, right? And probably in their 20s, uh, I would really be the crib keeper. That's okay.

Brendan 8:26

Like somebody has to be the ancestor at every gathering. Okay. I will not be the ancestor. I'm happy to be the elder. I don't want to be on the cusp of ancestral plane, you know.

Vuyanzi 8:42

Oh gosh. Okay, okay. So, what are we talking about today? I love it.

Brendan 8:49

So, today we're talking about yeah, like this concept of, I mean, actually, I think building off of what we were talking about just now, right? Like, um, where is that kind of line between like really like comfort and safety, which I think like keeps coming up for me. And I'm sure well, based on our little pre-chat, yeah. I think has also come up for you.

Vuyanzi 9:15

Yeah, yeah.

Brendan 9:16

Um, so I don't know, do you want me to go first?

Vuyanzi 9:19

Yeah, because I'd love for you to start it off. I know we were having an interesting chat in how this came about, so please.

Brendan 9:24

Yeah, and I I think like building off of like the queer joy moment, like I mean, it's really been coming up for me a lot recently, like in LGBT spaces, like especially global spaces, right? Because I think that you know LGBTQ people that live here, you know, we we know what the issues are here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're we're aware of like the gaps, but also like very aware of like the positive. Um, and so you know, we had the experience when we were um planning to bring the DA AGM here to Kenya.

Vuyanzi 10:04

And just in case, because I know we like to use letters, but can you say it all out so people would get it off?

Brendan 10:08

I'm trying to avoid putting people on black, but yeah, Democrats abroad, the global annual general meeting. Okay, there you go. Yes. Um, so I co-led the bid um with my our former chair um to bring the meeting here. Yes. And um, well, actually, to avoid throwing people under the bus, let me loop, let me lump two experiences together so that it anonymizes.

Vuyanzi 10:32

Okay.

Brendan 10:33

So also on the other side, of course, I'm a I'm an active member of Rotary International, um, which for those of you that don't know is an international service organization who also has like an annual global convention. And I happen to sit on the board of the LGBT plus fellowship within Rotary. Um, and so we the year after next are gonna be having our annual convention in well, it's proposed to have it in Dubai. And there's also been a lot of there's been a lot of feelings in both of those spaces from other queer people, mostly people that also look like me, just to be very clear. Yes. Um both people with beards.

Vuyanzi 11:19

People with beards, yeah.

Brendan 11:20

Often, yes, actually. It's usually the white men, but but you know, the ladies too. Um just like a lot of anxiety, you know. It's like um, which I think I felt more distinctively, like when we were talking about something involving Kenya, you know, because I was just like, you know, like I live here. So I I think you should be able to trust like my my lived experience. Yeah, like what were they saying? Or can we can we even go that way? I mean in in both instances, right? Like, I think there's like a lot of like, you know, kind of getting like hit over the head with like this is what the legislation says, these are the statistics, like just like a lot of like um, it's like that old like children's book, Chicken Little, like in the sky is falling. Like it's like a lot of like catastrophism about like it's like like it's like you know, if I come, like I'm gonna be like locked up immediately. Yeah, yeah, the safety, right? Yeah. And you know, I I think what was interesting, like in both spaces, right, was like really trying to tease out, like for instance, even like on the on the Dubai side, like because I've also traveled pretty extensively in the Middle East, and what I would call like a fairly visibly queer person. Like, I don't think I hide it that well. I mean, even my parents were not surprised when I came out to them in college, so they're like finally we went into the state. Yeah, like literally, but you know, like um, I have personally like, and again, of course, there's always an aspect of personal experience. Yes, and I'm white, so like that's also a thing, and I'm American, that's also a thing. Okay, but I have personally never felt unsafe. Have I felt uncomfortable at times? Sure. Have I also felt uncomfortable as a gay person living in America? Especially in the South. Well, even in the sorry, you grew up in upstate New York. I grew up in upstate New York. Like, it's not like Schenectady High School was like particularly like walled out the rainbow carpets, especially in like 2002.

Vuyanzi 13:38

So I go back further than that, right? Yeah. Um so so I'm hearing you say this about the safety and the comfortability.

Brendan 13:49

Well, and and I I what I found was fascinating was like especially like when engaging with people who you know are coming at this, usually from a Western perspective and often coming from Western countries. Like, yeah, I remember like you know, I mean, you you know, I you know I wake up every day ready to fight VMC. So it's like you want to throw some statistics at me, let's throw some statistics around. But the thing was, it's like, you know, so if you're, you know, for for example, speaking to me from let me not use a real example, the UK. Okay, um, you know, it's like if I look up hate crime statistics in the UK against LGBTQ people, there are thousands that occur every single year. And so you're in a place where the law is on your side, allegedly society is on your side. However, still statistics don't bear that out. Yeah, yeah. Whereas me living here in Kenya, where you know, yes, there are legal aspects that can make that challenging, like I mean, of course, I would say hate crimes here probably go underreported because of like the legal environment, but still, yeah, you know, if you're looking at six, seven, eight thousand hate crimes a year happening in a country that's smaller than this one, I guarantee you the rate is not equivalent here. And so, you know, part of that is because it's less visible, like you know, there are a lot of like factors that play into that, but it just really for me kind of blew my mind because I'm like, so you know, you're t telling me that you don't feel safe, you know, being in an African country or in a Middle Eastern country, but the reality is like you're not safe over there either.

Vuyanzi 15:36

Oh my goodness. Okay, yeah, let's talk about that for a second, right? Because I have many times gotten the you know, when when people knew I live moved to forget Kenya, they just think Africa, right? Because it's all one country anyway. So, and I'm being so sarcastic right now. And the question, the number one question is is it safe? And so here's the thing, because and I really just came to this as we've been sitting here doing our pre-talk before this podcast, that that is it safe question is about their discomfort in who they are, about where the place is, anything, all things Africa, right? The way we were or were not educated in the American school system. Because uh, I so some of the ways this question has been asked. One time I was in the States, I was in uh both, I've been in lived in New Jersey and New York, and I remember this one black man, and this is important for me to tell you this. He's a tall, visibly black black man uh who says, Well, I heard over there they don't like us. I'm like, dude, when you're going down the New Jersey turnpike, I can tell you who doesn't like you. I I can, I promise you, I promise you, I can tell you who does not like you. So I'm like, that's that's his discomfort though, with and he's projecting, right? That was the word that you used, that these people who've asked me this, is it safe? Is it safe? Oh, I want to, Africa's on my bucket list. Why do you have to wait all the way till your bucket, till right before you kick the bucket? I mean, I have a whole problem with that expression. Anyway, but anyway, it is that whole safe thing. It's like recognize that you you are uncomfortable with Africa. And recognize where that comes from. Recognize the data and what it shows about who you are, because a lot of times people asking me this look like me in America. So let's be clear, it's not all white people asking me this. And be clear on what the stats are. Be clear on that when my sons turned 16 and they were driving, or 16 or 17, and they had to uh drive a car, they were driving a car on them all on their own. I had to give them the talk. Yeah, you know what the talk is. And anyone who's watching and doesn't understand what the talk is, is that when a black man is driving, you tell him how to act when he is stopped by the police. Why do we do this? So he won't get killed. Imagine that in a country where you are its nationality, you grew up there, you lived there, you're born there, live there, eat there, die there. But you have to behave a certain way just because of the color of your skin. So when people have asked me, is it safe? Boo, are you safe? I put it in my off the car. I asked it for you. You had to go to Target this way. I asked it for you to try blessing this to go out the door. Yeah, I mean, and and if people would just look at it like that, the difference that it could make in terms of that perception, even if you don't, you know, you've been educated about Africa a certain way, which nowadays you can you can actually search engine it, right? You don't have to think that people Gemini AI will even give you a helpful summary. Listen, listen, is it safe? I was just gonna say this once, and I'm sure we'll always have these anecdotal stories. When I was talking to, I can't even say, okay, it's a person that had been in my life, um, a a white woman that's let's say about 10 years older than me. And then when I told her, Oh, yeah, I moved to Kenya, but we're on a um on a uh video call, and I was like, Yeah, and so I turned it around and I was showing her the big tall buildings, and she's like, oh my gosh, I thought it would have been hot.

Brendan 19:50

When I told people I was moving here, they were like, How are we gonna stay in touch? Like, are you gonna have electricity that I was excuse me?

Vuyanzi 20:03

Like, I'm so sorry. I'm sorry. I have to laugh at these things because I can't get mad. I have to laugh.

Brendan 20:09

I mean, I do think like like the intention is often not like like the intention is always coming, not always, usually coming from like a good place. But yeah, I I think there is it's this piece around like it's like sometimes the places where you feel the most comfortable are actually like not safe for you. You're just comfortable, right? Yes, and it's like on the flip side, sometimes the places where you feel the most uncomfortable are actually like much safer for you in reality.

Vuyanzi 20:45

Yes, you know. Um, and and this, okay, this is kind of touchy, but this is coming up for me, and I just want to share this because we're talking about safety and comfortability, and thinking about the way things were perceived or the projection. And what I mean by that is here's the specific example. In America, when you'd see, let's say back in the day, you're watching the news when people used to watch the news or whatever, or wherever it was, you see a crowd of black people and something bad has happened. That's what you equate it with. You're not saying, oh, look at it, look at it. It's like the crowd of blackness, and then everything associated like that. There's criminalized behavior must come out of that. So I even saw that, okay, so that's about safety and comfort. And even coming here for a bit, I noticed discomfort when I see groups of, let's say, people that look like me. Yeah. I said, where is that ew? Like I'm saying to myself, ew, where is that coming from? But I know exactly what it came from. We are so conditioned to that. Is it safe type of thing? Or when we see this, it is not safe. Safe. But no, it's just simply uncomfortable because you something was displayed to you. Um, and you being me, right? Something was displayed to you. You were told something about that. You unfortunately had nothing to uh contradict that. And so it's almost programming. Oh my gosh, that's what we're talking about here. It's the programming of uh the safety and the comfort and the projecting and our thoughts and really being having almost white supremacist thoughts, even as a black person, not even realizing it. So this is all very interesting. Oh my gosh.

Brendan 22:38

I know we could go on, but I I think well it and it reminds me of like when I first moved to Louisiana and I moved to Baton Rouge and I was there teaching in my little school.

Vuyanzi 22:50

Yeah.

Brendan 22:51

And I mean, trying to explain that experience to people that look like me, like whether it was like well-meaning people back home up north, or even like because when I first moved to Baton Rouge, you know, I you know, I was there with my little polo shirts, like, you know, just coming from my little upstate New York liberal arts college. So I like went to, you know, naturally, like I had grown up going to an Episcopal church. So I like went to the Episcopal Church and it was all white. And I was very confused. It was like I I got so used to like when I would say, Oh, like I'm Brendan, I work at Prescott Middle School. Like, people knew Prescott because like you know, they found some dead bodies on the roof and stuff, but I couldn't say but so like like the responses that people would give me, and it took me a while to realize, like, much like what we're talking about, like uh at some point I realized I actually feel safer and more comfortable there than I do here with y'all.

Vuyanzi 24:03

Wow.

Brendan 24:04

Because like there, you know, I mean you you know, black Americans, it's like, especially like once you become a part of the community, it's like you're part of the community.

Vuyanzi 24:13

It is you're a part of the community.

Brendan 24:16

And so, you know, it's like even when there were issues happening, like in the neighborhood, like I was very conscious of the fact that like that ain't got nothing to do with me. So, like, ain't nobody coming for me because I had nothing to do with all the issues. Yeah, exactly. I snitch, I see nothing. Wow but it's like like and and that was actually part of why I wound up removing myself from like a lot of majority white spaces, because at some point I realized like I actually fit in less here because y'all like like our lived experiences have at this point diverged so far.

Vuyanzi 24:50

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Brendan 24:52

Which is hilarious because actually the truth is like if you look at statistics, like it's the white place where you're about to get shot. Okay, we the ones showing up with the straight up. I mean, that's that's just reality, yeah you know, like it's and it's so funny how like it's like when you really dig into it, like most of the things that we're taught are actually the opposite of like reality.

Vuyanzi 25:24

And but it isn't that connected to white supremacy and making sure that everything is distorted from the welfare queen to the gangs that are killing people to you know everything you're perceiving. Oh, if it was a white shooter, it must be a mental health issue. Right, right, right. Every time, yeah, or disorder.

Brendan 25:45

Right. So yeah. There's a lot we could talk about, but yeah, yeah. I think that might be all the time.

Vuyanzi 25:51

Yeah, yeah. And I hear you say you taught out of middle school. I taught out of middle school too. So yeah, so we'll oh we've got a lot to talk about.

Brendan 25:58

Y'all tune back in. We'll be traded war stories over here.

Vuyanzi 26:01

Yes, yes. Oh my gosh. Let us know what you think about the conversation and chime in. We'll be waiting to hear from you.

Brendan 26:08

All right, y'all. See y'all next time. Bye.